There’s no ‘I’ in Team: Shawn Johnson East and Andrew East’s Secret to Success

00:09 - 00:21

Hi, everyone, and welcome to The Big Stage where we talk to athletes, artists and entertainers about their lives and impact. I'm your host, Adam Sansiveri, Bernstein Managing Director and Co-lead of Sports and Entertainment.

00:29 - 00:54

Power couple Shawn Johnson and Andrew East are no strangers to being in the public eye. In 2008, at 16 years old, Shawn was an Olympic gymnast representing the US gymnastic teams in Beijing, China. She won three silver medals and brought home the gold in the women's balance beam for those Olympic Games. Previously, she was the 2007 all-around world champion and a five-time Pan American Games gold medalist.

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Today, she's a mom, a bestselling author, influencer and an entrepreneur too. Andrew attended Vanderbilt University, where he played college football while getting a civil engineering degree. After graduating with his MBA, he played on several NFL teams, including the Kansas City Chiefs and the Washington Redskins. Today, Andrew and Shawn are as busy as ever, raising a young family and editing film and video content that they produce together. With millions of followers across their many platforms, one could say this business of being social is more than a mere job, but a passion. It's my pleasure to welcome Shawn Johnson and Andrew East to The Big Stage. My fellow Nashvillians, thanks for joining me today.

01:33 - 01:34

Thanks for having us.

01:35 - 01:35

Good to be here.

01:35 - 01:50

It's so good to see you guys. Let's start with your athletic beginnings. You were both introduced to sports from an early age, and they've had immense prominence in both of your lives. What do you think being an athlete so early on instilled in you from that young age?

01:50 - 02:05

Well, first of all, I always love hearing people do Shawn's resume in athletics and later mine. Because my accolades are so much fewer. They are incredible. Stop it! What do we, what do we learn?

02:05 - 02:38

I would say early athletics at such a young age for both of us because we both got to like a very high level at a young age. I think instilled in me personally just a drive. I got so used to spending every single day working towards something that after I retired, I remember going through phases of life where I didn't really have a goal or a race that I was in to a certain extent, and I didn't know what to do with myself. And I think having that like drive and passion and constant challenge in my life is a necessity now based off of what I learned in athletics, which I love.

02:39 - 03:16

Yeah, I think a big takeaway of mine was just having the ability and the reason to think outside of myself. So like, you know, playing a team sport of football, you have to think about your teammates and how your actions and your play affects them. But also just from like a professional standpoint, having to show up every day and focus on the task instead of yourself, like four a.m. morning workouts. I'm not feeling super pumped to be there, but I realize that because I, the focus is on the task and the team instead of myself, that gives you purpose and drive, so I feel like I've been able to carry that over into other phases of life as well.

03:16 - 03:27

Well, you both clearly have taken it into the success that you've built since retiring from sports, which we'll get to. But I'm actually curious, do you hope for your kids to get serious about sports of their choosing?

03:28 - 03:49

I put no pressure on our children to succeed at sports, but I do think sports teaches kids of every age incredible life lessons. Because it was our lifestyle, I foresee us putting our kids in every sport possible to see if they have a passion in one of them. But with that being said, if it's not sports, I'm sure it will be something else.

03:49 - 04:07

Well, those lessons you learn are great, but being a such a high level athlete at a young age has really demanding schedules I imagine. So, did you ever, Shawn, just want to be a normal kid? Or, you know, what did you do to find balance? And was that a possible thing?

04:07 - 04:36

Every other day it was an up and downhill roller coaster for me. But I think that's very normal as a kid because I did have such a demanding schedule. I was training anywhere from 20 to 40 hours a week on top of public school and doing everything you know, kids do. And for myself, going through so many different phases as a kid of like social life and afterschool activities, I definitely had a hard time balancing what my actual goals were.

04:36 - 05:09

I felt torn between wanting to be a normal high school kid who hung out with friends after school at the mall and an elite gymnast who spent six hours a day at the gym. And I was just very lucky to have a team around me, my coaches and my parents who never pushed the sport on me. They would truly ask me the same question every single day when I showed up to the gym or I went to the gym, I'm like, Do you want to be here? And if you don't, you can leave. And I think having that reverse psychology and having my decision have to be made every single day. Somehow it kept me going back.

05:11 - 05:15

Andrew, I'm sure it was different for you, right? Like playing football, you were just probably the most popular kid in school.

05:18 - 06:06

I definitely wouldn't say that. I do, you know, reflect on my experience playing sports growing up, and I feel like I was fortunate to have done it in the time period that I did. Because now I look at all these youth leagues and families uprooting themselves to be a part of this team or that team or traveling every single weekend or every week in the summer to like go, essentially like scout it out when you're eight years old. So my parents did a phenomenal job at like, Hey, we're doing this because you love it and we don't need you to do anything more or less. And honestly, the expectations for me were way lower than, like what Shawn experienced, where there was never a point where people looked at my career and they're like, This guy is a prodigy and we need to like, we need to like, you know, do everything we can to build him up. So it was, I'm fortunate, I look back on that and I feel like I'm lucky for that.

06:06 - 06:07

Yeah, I can imagine that's great.

06:07 - 06:31

Well, Shawn, speaking of, you know, being a prodigy at a young age, I'm sure you've been asked to relive this moment a lot, but we need to know. Can you describe what it felt like when you were all of 16 years old knowing that eyes all over the world were watching you as you won the Gold Medal in the women's balance beam in Beijing? Does anything like stand out to you to this day? About that moment?

06:32 - 07:22

Yeah. Everything. I can still... It sounds weird, like it's become a core memory, I guess. I can smell the arena. I can hear the crowd. I can feel like what the beam felt like. It truly was something that I will never forget. But I think for myself at 16, being still a kid, the world tries to like paint this picture of what the Olympics feel like and the world painted in the picture that if you won a gold medal, you had succeeded in life, like you had reached the epitome of life. And that was it. And I think because of maturity levels, I didn't see any other purpose besides that, and I was a very lucky gymnast. I absolutely loved my sport. It was a passion, unlike anything I had ever felt before, and I was truly just a kid in a candy store when it came to gymnastics.

07:23 - 08:04

And fast forward, when I was at the Olympics, it was the first time I felt torn between the pressures of society and my actual passion for the sport. And I remember when I won the Gold Medal, I felt so proud of myself because as the competitor I was, I knew I had succeeded and done my best. But I also, to a certain extent, felt slightly, I use this slightly, disappointed because the world painted like... I was supposed to feel so fulfilled and like everything in life was just taken care of, and I was kind of like, Wait, this is not.... this is still amazing, but it's not like, I don't feel like I can just be done with my life now. It's an emotional roller coaster.

08:04 - 08:10

I can imagine it, and there's a good life lesson in there that you just hit on, right? You have to enjoy that journey and not that destination.

08:10 - 08:15

Absolutely. And I feel like if you don't, then you're setting yourself up for more disappointment.

08:15 - 08:22

And on that note, I always find it interesting for such high performing successful individuals like both of you.

08:22 - 08:29

When you're asked the question about what's your proudest moment in life? It's rarely what people think. So I'm curious what you would say.

08:30 - 09:11

Oh dang, this is half the press right here, but there's nothing like having kids. Yeah. And yesterday I was in tears telling the story to Shawn, but I visited Drew at her little daycare. She was doing... It was like a little gymnastics portion of what she was doing. And this is the first time I've done this. But she was with probably like 15-20 other kids, and she got out of her chair when she saw me and ran over and gave me a big hug. And it's like, you know, you look at... I guess there's probably a thousand decisions that go into Drew being there and Dru being proud of me, but it's her preserving her image of me and like her being proud of me, that was like a really special moment. So I'm not about to cry.

09:14 - 09:15

That's a great answer.

09:16 - 09:38

I would say kids, I feel like my most proud moment changes like Eric said, every single day, seeing another milestone hit. I feel like just again, a kid in a candy store with our children, just watching them grow and learn. We've both achieved such awesome, like incredible things, and it doesn't even remotely compare.

09:38 - 09:42

I'm sure our listeners love hearing that, and I think maybe a surprise to a lot of people for

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Imagine if we were like, oh, Olympic gold.

09:45 - 09:52

Yeah, kids are great. But the NFL game. So Shawn,

09:52 - 10:04

I'd love your thoughts. You know, the world had its eyes on Simone Biles, and she shocked everyone when she withdrew from many events in last Olympics. What went through your mind when that happened and the scrutiny that she underwent?

10:05 - 10:29

My heart absolutely broke for her because nobody wants to be in that position. It goes, I don't want to say it goes without saying, but coming from my experience in gymnastics, I will stand by the statement for all of eternity. I think she is the greatest our sport has ever seen and will ever see. Truly, it's unmatched and I don't think anybody can have that margin that she has ever again.

10:29 - 11:23

That being said, what happened at the Olympics is a valid thing, especially what she went through. All gymnasts go through it. It was unfortunate that it happened at the Olympics, but I think a bigger movement that I saw from the eyes of a gymnast is for so long in the sport of gymnastics, the girls and the athletes never had voices. You've seen so much come out around gymnastics, and for so long you've seen athletes be walked on and walked over and to see Simone who so easily could have won everything, say, no, thank you. I'm going to step this one out. I think gave a voice to every little girl and boy who will ever be a part of the sport. And I think it was a really, really powerful thing that she did. No matter the circumstance, but I think it will change the trajectory of a lot of kids' lives in the sport of gymnastics.

11:24 - 11:25

Yeah, that's powerful. Thank you for sharing.

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Let's switch gears here for a minute. I want to ask you both being such serious athletes growing up, how did you come to learn about managing the money that you were making at a young age? Did you take an active role in learning about it? Was it your parents? Did you hire people or did you make mistakes? Give us a sense.

11:44 - 11:46

We have a very different stories.

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stories. Shawn's more interesting, so I'll get mine out of the way. I'll never forget my parents sitting me down and like showing me they had purchased a Eli Lilly stock in my name and it was worth like $4 or whatever. And so they were trying to explain the concept of like, Hey, hold on to this for 20 more years and it'll be worth $15 or whatever. So. So they had tried to implant lessons like that along the way, which I'm thankful for, but I feel like I've developed the complex, especially, you know, your rookie year in the NFL, four days a week of our six days of practice, we would have these kind of like forums held where they'd bring in an expert. A lot of times a subject that they were talking about would be finances, and they would say, you know, they give all these doom and gloom stats like, you know, 80 percent of the NFL players are broke within two years.

12:35 - 13:01

Yes. And so I still, like, I went from having I feel like a healthy relationship to money to then like having a very tight grasp that like, you know, like concerned, always worried, like, Oh no, we're going to be broke, and I got to take care of my family. When's it going to go south? I feel like I'm continuing to try to work myself out of that and, you know, meeting you and Dan has been fantastic because you provide such a good perspective, but that would be my journey.

13:01 - 13:27

I feel like. Yeah, I do feel like there's a lot of pressure on athletes, though, because professional athletes and finances is such a widely talked about and I don't know, put on a pedestal topic, I guess. But for me, it was a lot different because I turned professional at 12, so I signed my first contract at 12 and talking about finances to a 12-year-old is absolutely ridiculous.

13:28 - 14:02

So everything for me was between me and my parents and my managers and agents, and we hired a financial team and my parents, just like from day one, started like implementing lessons of what you work for and how you spin it and how you preserve it. And like everything that I ended up retiring, quote unquote retiring when I was 19, so my entire career was still while I was a kid, and it wasn't until later on in life that I, with Andrew ended up working with finance teams and learning everything and taking actual like a hands on approach.

14:02 - 14:08

Is there any advice that either of you would give to maybe the next generation of young athletes?

14:08 - 14:49

Yeah, yeah. There's a theme that I have grown to appreciate is who, not how is a better way to approach a problem. So finding experts in the space or mentors or people who truly do this day in and day out, I've found has relieved so much stress and anxiety in this realm for us. I remember we spent, I guess, two or three years ago, like six months getting all of our accounting taken care of, understanding all of our investments, like getting them all transferred over and dialed in. And it was a lot of work to include someone else in that and and dig in to the extent that I could and understand. But having someone else really hold your hand through it was massively helpful.

14:49 - 15:16

Yeah, I would also say learn. I had such stress over finances just because I didn't understand them, and I understood the concept that I was making money, but I didn't understand like how you take care of that. And I think with Andrew and like this team, the more you learn, the more like freedom you feel, more confidence you feel and understanding what you can do with finances and what your potential is and what your limits and boundaries are, I think gives you a lot of like emotional freedom.

15:16 - 15:35

Yeah, because it's not all about like just always spend less, because that's kind of an impulse when you are worried about going broke or like you don't know enough. But then as you start to understand, like, Hey, actually, I have this much to spend on myself this month, or I can buy Shawn this size gift and that comes with educating yourself and digging in more and more. Shawn,

15:35 - 15:41

Shawn, like where Andrew's mind's going. He's talking about buying you gifts. Yeah, you got a good one there.

15:42 - 15:59

So Andrew, we've had a number of NFL players on this podcast, from Aaron Rodgers to Derek Morgan to Eddie George, few other folks. I'd be curious what your experience was playing in the NFL through different teams and just give our listeners a little bit insight into what that was like for you.

15:59 - 16:56

You know, piggybacking off the last subject, I just feel so fortunate to have earned way more money than like Aaron Rodgers. The longest I played for a team was four months, and then I would get released and then signed back on. So I think I ultimately played for eight or nine different pro teams, like on the one hand, I'm bummed out because in my mind, I thought that I would be playing with the Kansas City Chiefs, who I signed with out of college for like 15 years and just be, you know, established there. But it was cool to get to experience different coaches like Pete Carroll and Jay Gruden and Jon Gruden. And I got all these different locker room experiences, too, so I feel like I got to kind of sample what the NFL was like. Now, I would never have drawn it up that way, but I would never change it. So it was really fun. It was probably like a good phase that's it's now over, I feel like.

16:56 - 17:11

So, yeah, well, I've read that you realized you wanted to develop other areas of your life that you would be feeling more grounded and fulfilled than in professional football. So if that's true, how did you go about that? And is it safe to say that you've achieved that goal?

17:11 - 17:59

It's about the process, like we were talking about, Adam, so I feel like I'm on my way to achieving that. But there's definitely was a point for me... So my position was a long snapper, which we play like seven plays a game, maybe. And it's like, you know, it's kind of a stretch to say that I was playing football at the end of the day, so I kind of realized one day standing at practice just on the sideline, like I spent more hours and I probably should have just standing there watching because that was my position that I was like, man, I feel like there's more that I could be doing with my life and talent. So that's when we started to kind of explore YouTube and content creation, and that part of my career has proven to be like way more fun, fun in a different way. But like, it's now something I could do for 15 more years. So yeah, I feel like I'm in the process of proving that.

17:59 - 18:00

Yeah. That's great.

18:00 - 18:35

Well, let's get into that and let me start by presenting you both with some fun facts. Did you know? And maybe you do, maybe you don't, that you have more Instagram followers than share: Venus Williams, Claire Danes, Guy Fieri and Kevin Bacon. We did a little research, and that's pretty incredible. Let's talk about your social media empire. Help us understand how you've managed to build such a robust social media business. You know, a lot of celebrities and athletes have tried to do the same thing with far less success. So do you mind sharing how you've gone about achieving such high numbers?

18:35 - 19:16

It has been a process, so I think it all stemmed from my background, which was I worked in sports entertainment within my career for 10 years. I worked with every possible company you can imagine and I worked within sports entertainment contracts, which were very controlling. They told you what you could wear, what you could say, how you could look, how you presented yourself and they molded this brand of you and what they portray to the media and how you are portrayed was basically edited and chopped together to be brand appropriate. And I got to work with these companies for so long and learn kind of the ins and outs of marketing and of content creation and how they marketed things.

19:16 - 19:46

Fast forward to football. Andrew needed a pastime hobby, and he taught himself how to YouTube, and he learned the back-end analytics of everything from algorithms to data to what you do with it. And he said, Why don't we kind of start doing this on our own, doing this whole marketing side of content creation? And I loved the idea of it. I loved being able to create something that was actually raw and something that we could edit on our own and kind of share our own

19:46 - 20:16

But I also had never operated outside the boundaries of what these brands would allow you to show. So it was kind of this like pastime hobby of showing our life and trying to be relatable, and we saw an opportunity there to actually impact people's lives and create shows and create podcasts and produce and edit and build something that we truly enjoy doing. And I think it's really challenging for us on a daily basis, which is what kind of drives us to want more of it.

20:17 - 20:31

Well, and it's clear you enjoy doing it because it's so much fun to watch. You guys are so likeable. You're so cute as a couple, your family is so beautiful. What's your favorite part? I mean, there's so many different channels, outlets, what do you enjoy the most? Which channel or which part?

20:31 - 21:27

Oh man. Well, that's a fun thing. It always changes. I feel like, you know, now we're in the era of short-form content like TikTok and Instagram Reels and YouTube shorts. It's such a fun playground to experiment in because you could post five a day and maybe three of them do really well but two of them tank, whereas like a YouTube video, you'd spend hours and hours producing this video and editing it, and then you don't know how it's going to perform. So it's just more of an experiment friendly world here. But Shawn, I feel like, is a pioneer in the space where we started the channel in 2015 on YouTube, and she was really like the only mainstream quote unquote celebrity who had a YouTube channel. And so I feel like her setting aside her pride and being like, Yeah, I'm going to let my husband film and edit these YouTube videos was like much credit to her, but it's fun to see how we've grown and evolved and learned together through it.

21:28 - 22:10

Well, I think to the challenge that I loved and what ultimately got me hooked on it is, especially for professional athletes, our seasons come and go very quickly. And for Olympic athletes, every four years, things are recycled and you're forgotten. And as far as a career standpoint, I almost saw it as a challenge every four years to reinvent myself and keep my name out there in whatever way, shape or form that was. And when social media really took off and careers were made out of it, I guess, it was a challenge to constantly recreate brands, and it was just like a puzzle that we get to redo a million times over. And it's really fun.

22:10 - 22:13

Oh yeah, I can imagine, and it's still changing so fast.

22:14 - 22:23

You mentioned those brand partnerships. I'm curious to know how you choose who you'll agree to partner with. Are there specific parameters that you have or values you look for?

22:23 - 22:47

Yeah, we're super fortunate because of Shawn's background in like the sports marketing realm, and she's been doing it since she was 12. We have a pretty strong selection out of the gate where it's like, we're not talking about new startup brands. It's a lot of times like established brands like Kroger, like infomercial baby food. So we feel really strong of these are products that we use, is the filter.

22:47 - 23:32

And then everything we do like the the content side of things we're always concerned with, how can we provide value to our audience. And there's always a spectrum. I view it as as far as like entertainment and education. And so with short form content, we are usually more on the entertainment side of things where it's like, Hey, can we make someone smile or laugh today? And then the podcast is more on like the educational side of things like, Hey, can we bring on an expert to share x y z topics? So the goal is to bring value with our videos and with our brand partnerships, it's the same mindset where it's like, Hey, we know so much about our audience. We know like the demographic, they have kids. And yet, yada yada, is this something that would help them out? And again, the first filter is, has it helped us out? And then we go from there.

23:32 - 23:46

We don't promote anything we don't believe in. Even if it's like a new product to us, we'll test it out for a long time before we ever promote it. And we have to align with the brand. We have to align with their values and what their company stands for. I mean, we go through a lot of vetting.

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We've turned down some deals where it really hurts and you're like, Oh man, I wish we could say yes to this. But anyway, it's better in the long run when we don't.

23:57 - 24:23

I'd love to know what those are, but I'm not going to put you... You just mentioned your podcast, and I know in 2019, I think you launched the podcast called Couple Things where you discuss marriage and family and host other couples doing the same thing. You recently hit your one hundredth episode. You're even taking the show on the road. So congratulations, that's really exciting. So what's been the most surprising or fun thing you've discovered through this podcast and the conversations you're having?

24:23 - 25:02

I would say the reinventing again. We are constantly trying to reach new audiences and connect with them and serve something up that people need. And I think with this one, we really wanted to target couples and celebrate families because we think they're pretty cool and we really wanted to shine a positive light on relationships because I feel like the media likes to do the opposite, and we weren't sure how it would go over. And I think for us, the most surprising and rewarding thing was to see that it went over really well, and people actually wanted positive content, and they wanted to celebrate families like we did, which is cool.

25:02 - 25:40

Yeah. So again, the education versus entertainment, I feel like Shawn, as far as content that she consumes is more of like the entertainment side of things. But any podcasts or videos that I watch, I am always trying to learn something. And so this has been a really fun outlet for us to like, bring on authors or, you know, trained experts who have like pedigrees in this and like, just pick their brain. So like yesterday, I talked to the CEO of this big healthcare company. It's just like, I love it. I love to hear how these fantastic... I'm sure you do as well, Adam, like hearing, how different people do life and have navigated whatever success or failures that they've had.

25:40 - 25:51

Oh, absolutely. You've given us some good financial advice, but I have to ask you, given how great of a relationship you guys have, this podcast you're part of, any relationship advice you'd give our listeners?

25:53 - 25:55

Don't work with your spouse. I'm kidding.

25:56 - 26:34

I think one thing I like is always try to keep the criticism as small as possible. It's so easy to when you're emotionally inflamed, but like say, Shawn didn't whatever. What didn't I do? Whatever. Didn't like cooked dinner, right? Instead of me being like, Oh, Shawn, you never cook dinner. Yeah, that's just like a false statement. There's a better way to do it is, Hey, I noticed you didn't. You know, I noticed there was no dinner, I just want to make sure everything's all right like... We're usually on top of this, like essentially speaking to the better side of them as opposed to maybe she did make a mistake today. Don't overblow that and make it dramatic.

26:34 - 26:59

I would say, always look for the best in your spouse. I don't know, we all can gain momentum, whether it's positive or negative, very easily. So if you're having a bad day and you're like, Oh, why didn't he do this? And you just like, keep building on that, that can very quickly turn the tables for you. And I think if you constantly look for something that's good or positive about your spouse, you can get through anything.

26:59 - 27:01

Thanks for sharing that, guys.

27:01 - 27:15

So we're coming towards the end of our show, but I always want to hit on one important topic in these conversations, and that's philanthropy. So, you know, I'd love to know what motivates you both philanthropically in the community or causes that you're both interested in. On this note,

27:16 - 27:38

would highly recommend looking into donor advised funds. I'm surprised. Well, I didn't know about it until like two or three years ago, but that tool, that financial tool, has drastically changed and really unlocked, like more generosity from us. You're not worried about like, I'm not going to donate this because there's complexities that are taken care of when you do a donor advised fund. But we're involved with several, I know Hope Sports.

27:38 - 28:24

Hope Sports is how we got connected. So I was introduced to Andrew's older brother, Guy East who helps run Hope Sports, and it was one of the things we connected on on our first date. But he runs it in Tijuana and it's a mission where you fly to Tijuana. You build a house for an impoverished family in 48 hours like start to finish, and the entire time, the whole concept of Hope Sports is the people who are building them are usually professional athletes. It has since expanded to like CEOs and just like anybody who can be a part of it. But through it, it's showing professional athletes that there's actually more to life than just sport. And it kind of just like opens your eyes and gives you a community to kind of heal from in the transition of professional sports.

28:24 - 28:53

I got to go on one of the builds and it changed my life and got to meet Guy and his family and Andrew. And it's something that we're really just passionate and love with, which we've done a lot of build since then. Any children's hospital we, we used to do before the pandemic go on like tours or work with Make-A-Wish or work with just like children's hospital foundations and do hospital visits. And the last one would be the Special Forces. Special Forces, Charitable Trust.

28:53 - 29:20

There's a lot of them. Tying it back to the theme of how important it is to think outside of yourself, like, that's for sure. Then, you know, we went through a phase where it's just us, like, we're just worried about our career and making our money. And then it's like, like Shawn on the Gold Medal podium, you get to whatever goal you were shooting for and you're like, Huh, wow, what's next? What else? And so for us, that's been like so much more fulfilling to give in whatever way we can.

29:21 - 29:33

I love hearing all that, so much stuff and, Andrew, great piece of advice for the donor advised fund. We couldn't agree more. So, guys, I thank you for your time. It's so much fun seeing you and spending some more time together, and I appreciate you joining us on The Big Stage.

29:34 - 29:35

Thank you for having us.

29:35 - 29:38

Thank you all for listening. This has been The Big Stage.

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